Okay the Old Man, Novice Scroller Has Another Question/Comment

[pddesertrat]

Most of the info, tutorials, videos, I have read/watched on applying patterns for scrolling say to cover the board with blue painters tape, apply pattern sprayed with adhesive, them cover with clear packing tape.  That is what I have been doing.  However when I look at pictures of "in process" scrolling by the accomplished scrollers  I don't often see the blue painters tape.  I would think on a delicate pattern, i.e., like Charles Dearing's, using the painters tape could lead to breaking off some of the pieces that you don't want broke off.  Where as, it you applied the the pattern directly to the wood and removed it with Mineral Spirits it would be safer.

What are the more experienced scrollers thoughts? 

[scrollgirl]

Yes and no. While you can use mineral spirits to effectively remove the pattern and residue, I have found that it is very difficult to control the application of the temporary spray adhesive and there are times it can loosen before you would like, and other times when it is cemented into place. The LAST thing you want when working on a pattern the like Charles' patterns is to have it flapping up as you are trying to scroll. Conversely - it can be just as difficult to remove it - even with mineral spirits - if stuck on too firmly. There is also the risk of spotting and residue left on the pieces, which will interfere with the final finish.

Using painter's blue (or green here in Canada) tape first give you an 'insurance policy' that you will have good adhesion, yet CONTROLLED removal. There is no guesswork, hot spots (where it sticks more than others) and when the piece is supported properly, you can remove it from the most delicate pieces using a small knife and SLOWLY peeling it up.  I think it is a more reliable way to go.

Also - as a final thought - I find it unnecessary to add clear tape if you are using the painter's tape underneath. Unless the wood is extra dense/thick and is subject to burning, the painter's tape provides both purposes.

Just my thoughts.

Sheila

[GrayBeard]

I have used the 'blue tape' method and also just applying the pattern to the wood. Personally I like the pattern applied directly to the wood better. More control and as you said less problems with minute details!

After cutting I spray the entire area with Mineral Spirits and let them soak in...the pattern comes off easily.

~~~GB~~~

[pddesertrat]

Hummmm, looks like it is "different strokes, for different folks!"

[scrollgirl]

Well - I always say "there is more than one path to the same destination."  Like with computers - there are many RIGHT ways to do things. You just need to try some of the options and do what YOU feel more comfortable doing.  

Sheila

[EIEIO]

i've used stick-on labels for the last few pieces. it is cleaner than the spray adhesive and comes off with mineral spirits. it seems to help if you first sand the blank - the adhesive holds better.

I use clear tape if it's a thick blank or 3 layers. otherwise no tape.

[julief]

I've tried both methods and for me, the tape is a waste of time and money.  The only time I use tape is when I am cutting wood that tends to burn.  As far as Charles Dearing patterns and the like,  I use spray adhesive and attach directly to the wood.  I have cut many of Charles patterns and have no problem following or removing them when done.  Either spray or dab some mineral spirits on the paper and wait a minute.  The paper and glue residue comes right off.

[pddesertrat]

I wonder if the spray on adhesive acts a lubricant like tape.  And how does anyone know that the tape helps prevent burning.   Were formal test done or is it just supposition?  I'm not questioning it really, just curious.  I know it can help prevent chip out.  I use tape when sawing plywood on my table saw, and other saws when sawing BB and other plywood to prevent chip out.  It works. 

Another thing I want to try someday, and maybe someone else has already, but I've thought maybe if the piece of wood was coated with shellac or some other finish that soaked in some, would prevent chip out and strengthen the wood a little where there are very fragile bridges.  Just some stuff I ponder as I scroll away. 

[scrollgirl]

I don't feel that the adhesive from the spray glue helps stop burning at all. I can say this from my own experience. But then again - I only use very light coats so I may not be the best one to offer an opinion. I also can attest to the effectiveness of the packaging tape or painter's tape preventing burning. I have had pieces where I got a little "lazy" and left an edge or corner without tape over them, and as soon as the blade travels through that area - the edges burn. This happens with oak, maple, walnut and many of the other wood that I use on a regular basis. You should also give it a try yourself. As soon as you travel back into the taped areas - no burning again. The evidence was good enough to convince me (and I am reminded each time I "miss" an area!)

As far as the spray and patterns directly on the wood vs. a layer of tape first - I had not done this prior to three years ago when I attended a wood show in Saratoga Springs, NY.  Some of the other scrollers have done it and it really made things easier for me. Here in Canada, the quality of the brand of spray wood glue we used has really been erratic. Sometimes it came out in strings. Sometimes blobs. We bought (MANY!) cans of fresh from many different places and even tried other brands, but we found our results to be spotty at best. I can't tell you how many partially used cans I had to throw out. I got tired of returning them and the stores probably thought I was trying to scam them!

I suppose it depends on what YOU find works for you.   I also have used full sheet labels which are not expensive. You can find them on Amazon pretty cheap and they work great at well. Just be sure if you get the "super stick" ones to 'de-stick' them a bit before applying. They can be stubborn if they hold too tightly.

I like the painter's tape when I want certain and consistent holding. Yes - it is not perfect for everything, as others have said. I agree with them too.

Your best bet is to try some of these suggestions from everyone and figure out what will work best for you based on cost, availability, what type of project you are making, and your own personal preference. 

Isn't it GREAT that we have so many WONDERFUL choices?   

Let us know what you like as well.

Sheila

[Graywolf]

I use green painters tape, because that's what I get now. If blue is available I use it, on the blank, then glue stick the tape, then apply the pattern, then shipping tape. It seems to work for me.

[edward]

I been using Blue painters tape since it came out, and I like it, comes odd the wood real easy, sometimes you have to be careful with delicate areas.Overall it works for me.  edward

[pddesertrat]

First off, thank you all for the great replies.  I really appreciate how willing everyone is willing to share their knowledge.  Second, please don't think my questions and comments are ever meant to challenge anyone.  I am just an inquisitive guy and like to gain knowledge.  I do a lot of "pondering" whilst working in my shop.

[scrollgirl]

Oh - I don't think for a moment that your questions are challenging anyone (in a combative way)!  That is what this forum are for - sharing! I love it here because the members always seem to realize that there is more than one way to do things. We all have the greatest respect for each other and get along fine!

These are the types of things that everyone learns from. I love reading all the possibilities and learning new things.

Keep on asking!

Sheila

[Merlin]

When I first started scrolling I sprayed the back of the pattern and applied the pattern to the wood or when I couldn't get spray stik glue ans to get the pattern off I used a heat gun and pattern lifted quite nicely.

Now I use tape and the stik glue but for more delicate work first method with the heat gun cause tape can still break the more fragile bits.  My opinion only 

***Merlin***

[julief]

I like to know "why", also.  I've been scrolling for a long time and have been on this forum since the beginning.  I have learned so much from suggestions from other people.  There is no "right" or "wrong" way to do these things.  You try many methods and find what works for you.  I read this forum daily.  The folks here have become almost like family.  Feel free to "challenge" us.  We enjoy a good challenge.