Need advice on a sander

[Becky]

I've been going along with a combo disk and belt sander that I picked up at Harbor Freight.  I didn't use the disk part for a long time until I discovered that I could get a stick-on hook and loop backer from Klingspor, making it easy to change sanding discs.  Long story short, I love the concept but I am not wild about my machine.  I'm ready to plunk a bit more money down but I realize I have a lot of questions.

I've been making some clocks.  The past couple of patterns have required 30 degree bevels for pointed roofs.  Maybe I am not good at bevels on my saw or maybe it is something else but my pieces never came out even.  I had some luck on a small clock just leaving the pieces square and then sanding with the disk sander at 30 degrees to sand everything nice and even after assembly.  I am not even sure if I should use a belt or a disk sander to do that (question #1!).  Which is the best tool for that sort of thing?

Next, I don't think the angles I am getting when I switch the thing to 30 degrees is all that accurate.  I can do the housing part and then the roof pieces and they don't match up *quite* right.  What's the best way to make sure my angles are right?

Finally, do you have a sander you would recommend?  Even if the angle was perfect, my little table rocks a little and that can't be good although I honestly don't know how bad it is.  I don't know if my mis-fits are due to table movement or funky angles.

Anyway, I sure would be grateful for some advice.  Better tool, better technique - I am open to anything that will help.

I started making a larger clock and I don't think my 6" disk is big enough (even if it is the right sort of tool to use for this).  What size should I be looking at - belt or disk?

Ideally, I would be looking for a bench top size because my shop is small and I don't have much extra space for stationary tool.  OTOH, I could look at a drastic rearrangement if I really need something like that.  I don't think I could spend in the thousands on this but I could wrangle a few hundred.  I've been saving my pennies.

[EIEIO]

I have a Porter-Cable disk and belt that I'm happy with. It's an 8" disk and 4" belt. I also have the Ridgid oscillating drum/belt sander that works great. It's easy to switch from drum to belt. I usually have a coarse belt on the Ridgid and a fine belt on the P-C. Both have tilting tables.

I would suggest that sanding an angle into your roof would be better on the belt sander than the disk sander since it would give a consistent sanding across the width, where the disk sander will vary from full speed down near the edge to zero at the center to full up on the opposite end.

I would also suggest that you cut the angle with your saw but leave about 1/8" past the line, then set the tilt angle and sand off the last bit on the belt sander. That minimizes the sanding while giving a clean final edge. On the Ridgid the belt goes right to left for about 12" and oscillates up and down when you sit on the tilt table. With the P-C the belt goes top to bottom when you are on the tilt table but is only 4" wide. The Ridgid will sand a wider roof ridge as it cuts across the wood.

To set the angle, you could use your wall gable as the gauge to set the table tilt angle. That will make the angle at the ridge the same as the angle of the gable so they should match very closely.

[Al W]

I have found using one of the digital angle cubes works out great for me in setting up.  Mine has magnets installed and holds onto the Harbor Freight sander I use.  I also use a Random Oribital Sander (ROS), a spindle sander, and sanding blocks. 

I agree with what EIEIO stated, cut a shade wide, then sand to the line.  Don't be afraid to do a bit of sanding by hand as well, not everything has to be done with a power machine.

Best of luck, and hang in there.

Al

[Becky]

Thanks for your comments.

I think the belt part of the sander had a very small "table" (more of a ledge) once upon a time.  It's probably still out there somewhere but it definitely didn't tilt.  I've seen belt sanders with tilting tables which made me ask which process would work better.  I've tried to use the belt to create straight edges but haven't had much luck.  That's why I tried the disk - it worked a lot better.  I get what you're saying about the different speeds along the diameter of the disk but I have been pushing the pieces across so they get the whole spectrum of speeds.  It's just that once you get too much past the center the side that is moving up makes the piece jump.  That's why I thought maybe a bigger disk would solve the problems.

I have one of those digital angle things but admit it never occurred to me to use it.  Probably stupid of me to trust the markings but I venture into the stupid zone on an all too regular basis.     There are some smaller decorative pieces that I was prepared to skip because the angle just wasn't right and I thought it would look better without them than with them.  I think I will re-cut them and try sanding in the angle using the digital thing and see how that goes.  They are only about 1/4" square and the side I need to reduce is scalloped.  I'd never be able to draw an appropriate line to even try to saw that.

I'll try the cutting the bevel on the longish side next time too.  Maybe I should practice that on some scrap too.  I have a lot of trouble following the line with any significant tilt on the table.

But I'm also going to continue looking into either a wider belt with a tipping table or a bigger disk.  It worked so great on the smaller clocks.  I don't mind hand sanding - I did a lot of it on this clock.  I've just seen how it *can* be now.  The clock has a few issues here and there but I certainly wouldn't call it a disaster.  And, fortunately, it is planned as a gift for my father who is genetically incapable of seeing fault in my projects.  Once I get it done (I hope to have the lacquer out by next weekend), I'll post a pic in the brag forum.

And I will definitely hang in there!  I haven't made a project yet that hasn't been a learning experience in some way.  I guess if it was too easy I would get bored and quit.

Thanks for the tips.

[julief]

Becky, I have a Rikon 10" disc, 48" X6" belt and a Ridgid belt/oscillating sander.  Both tables tilt but even with the 10" disc, you still have that half way point that becomes problematic.  I usually use the Ridgid belt.  The table tilts accurately and I have more room for the project.  There is a slot on the table, but no accessories came with it and I haven't found one for it but you can easily make one to help you hold your place.

[Jim Finn]

The most used tool in my shop is my 6"x48" Harbor Freight stationary belt sander with a 9" disk.  I did not even install the disk.  I find that disk sanders burn the wood too easy. This sander costs less than $200.  Hooking up my dust collection system to this tool was kinda' tricky but it does work well now.

[Becky]

More things to look into.  Thanks for you input.  It looks like the Rigid sander only comes with a 4" belt.  Has that always been wide enough?  I like all the positive stops it has.  I like the looks of this one and it has the added plus of being a spindle sander too.  I don't have one of those.

The Harbor Freight one would definitely require some space-making in the shop.  I don't really want to do that if I don't have too but I will keep it in mind if I can't find something for the bench top.

Meanwhile, I did play with the digital angle guide tonight and am happy to report that I was able to salvage my little decorative pieces and re-sand them so they would work.  As it turned out, it needed a sharper angle than 30 degrees.  I played with scrap to find the right angle and then was able to modify my existing pieces.  It didn't even make enough of a difference to have to recut them. 

[julief]

The 4" belt on the ridgid is big enough to do what you want to.  The little bracket on the left can be removed if you need to sand something wider.  The spindle comes in very handy.  It is the most used sander in my shop.

[EIEIO]

Note that the belt on the Ridgid moves horizontally while oscillating up and down, so when you hold your workpiece on the tilted table, you can sand a wide surface (about 12"). This is kind of like a 12" wide belt sander. The oscillation keeps you from wearing the belt out at the level of the table. Also note that the belt change and tracking adjustment are right in front of you - no screwdrivers etc. to change belts. I'd think this would be near perfect for your birdhouse roof work.

That sander sells for $199 at Home Depot, and Menards sells replacement sanding drum sets (80 and 150 grit) for $7.99. I bought some replacement drums but have not needed to use them yet.

[Rapid Roger]

Another vote for the Ridgid oscillating belt/drum sander. I love mine too.
I also have another tip for sanders.
You can clean the sand paper by sanding a piece of cork! I know, I know, I didn't believe it either until I tried it.
I used a cork from a wine bottle and doggone it, IT WORKED! So now I have a small plastic bag of wine bottle corks that a friend gave me (I'm a beer drinker myself) and another large piece of cork right near the sanding station.
Try it, you'll like it! 

Rog

[Becky]

I've been doing some offsite reading on this sander and I am about 95% sold.  I may just be driving over to Home Depot today or tomorrow to eyeball it.   

[Becky]

I thought I should follow up and tell you all that I bought it.  I walked out of the first Home Depot as they didn't have a display unit.  Since my purpose was to check it out a little in person before making the leap, that kind of defeated the purpose.  There's another HD just down the road a few mile so I went there.   They did have a display model and I was impress with how solid it was.  No wobble and shake to the table and I like all the positive indents.  Took me a while to get it tracking right but that was my own fault for not reading the instructions carefully enough.  I played a round with it a little but it was hot as blazes out in the shop/garage so it wasn't long before I was wilting and went in the house.  I'll give it a better test when I have a real purpose/project for it but it looks like it will be a nice addition.

Thanks again for your suggestions!